Since bringing the later industrial two-cylinder tractors to light, have any more been found by col­lectors? I keep looking for an ad for a Waterloo trac­tor, or for one to show up on an auction. What do you think the chances are for that to happen? I have a yellow "420" U, and would like to have a Waterloo tractor to make it a pair. Did you arrive at any con­clusion as to how many total "20" Series Industrials were built at Waterloo?

I'm not a big-time toy collector, but I do have all of the Two-Cylinder Club Expo Toys and I'll eventu­ally fill that collection. I jumped on the chance to get the Industrial "820" and "620" Toys, and now these are the first ones people ask about when they see my lineup.

If any more information on Waterloo Industrials becomes available, please run it. I think these will probably become the most interesting tractors in two-cylinder collections.

W.C., Ohio

Since the feature article on Industrial Two-Cylinder Trac­tors (May-June 2004) and the followup in "Commen­tary," we have received word of two additional Waterloo "20" Series Tractors. They were already in the hands of col­lectors and the articles did not lead to their discovery, but they did inspire the owners to contact the Club.

The chance for a late (numbered model) Industrial Waterloo Two-Cylinder Tractor to eventually appear in a sale or on auction seems certain. Tractors are continually changing hands, and it's just a matter of time until one becomes available. It will be in the best interests of both seller and potential buyers to become comfortable that ade­quate physical documentation proves the lineage of the tractor. This could include paper documentation that might date back to the original dealer or customer. Short of paper documentation, the physical evidence offered by the tractor itself can confirm the presence of original industrial yellow paint and/or industrial options. Unfortunately, it will be the green-and-yellow tractors sold through the Industrial Equipment Division that will likely be lost to the ages unless paper documentation or obvious original industrial options can be confirmed. Insofar as production quantities are concerned, we have no new information that modify the estimates ofG.A. Nipper (July-August 2007), who was put in charge of industrial sales at Waterloo at the time the John Deere Industrial Equipment Division was formed in late 1956.

Regarding the Industrial Toys, a third and final "20" Series Tractor is being planned, and it will likely be the most distinctive toy in your or anyone else's collection. Intended to fit between the Industrial "820" and "620" Standards, this will be the Industrial "720" Diesel Stan­dard painted entirely ag yellow! Deere offered agricultural yellow as a no-charge option for industrial tractors only during 1957 and 1958. Jerry Nipper had remembered that a small number of industrial tractors actually were painted ag yellow, specifically citing a "720" Standard. After that information was published in Two-Cylinder, we received a call from a retiree who remembered one such tractor and said that it was kept at the factory for "quite some while" being used in heavy tasks, even including some machine moving when it came time to tool up for the New Genera­tion. He also remembered an Industrial "620" of the gen­eral-purpose version with a wide front axle, painted indus­trial yellow rather than ag yellow, that was kept by the factory in similar service. We have discovered that this tractor is still owned by Deere today; in storage and await­ing eventual restoration. The "720" Diesel Standard was equipped with the regular 30-inch rear wheels rather than the industrial wheel equipment option, and was loaded up with outside-mounted wheel weights. The toy will be equipped accordingly.

The Industrial "820" sold out briskly, and we suspect that more people could relate to this fairly well-known tractor. The Industrial "620" Standard did not sell as well, and there are several cases still in stock. Even though we expected it to be less popular, the same number were produced in consideration of collectors who might wish to pair it up with their "820". Now, the Industrial "720" Diesel Standard in agricultural yellow will complete the set of three, and the number produced will be the same as the Industrial "820" and "620" Standards, so those who wish to should be able to have the collection of all three. The all-ag-yellow Industrial "720" will likeky be the only authorized toy ever produced in that color, which is why it is being offered last.

I was so upset and disgusted when I saw the cover of the January-February issue, I tossed it aside and am not even going to look through it. The title of the magazine is Two-Cylinder, and the purpose of it is to cover two-cylinder tractors. If this is the direction it is going, you can count on me to not renew!

J.L., New Hampshire

In two years, it will be the 50th Anniversary of the introduction of the New Generation Tractors. Over the past 20 years, the central focal point of the vintage John Deere Tractor hobby has shifted from the 1930s to the 1950s. At the time of the Club's first Expo in 1987, there were many complaints of us allowing styled two-cylinder tractors into the show. We received angry phone calls and letters that "Numbered" model tractors had been exhibited, and there was one particular complaint that is well remem­bered, "those ugly tractors with the yellow stripes will never be accepted by collectors" (he was referring to the two-cylinder "20" and "30" Series).

Individuals have their personal favorites. With some, these favorites are permanent, while other folks shift their attention from one model to another. We felt it important to pass along an accumulated 25 years of research about New Generation production information to readers at this time. There are those who believe that was a mistake, but the large majority of responses have indicated approval. Either way, it was a long thought-out decision.

As should be expected, it is always our intent to provide information that is useful and interesting. But, we confess that our interest in vintage John Deere products is broad, and the feature subject chosen for a specific issue may miss the mark by a mile for readers whose interests lie elsewhere.

The reason for the New Generation feature was stated on page two of the January—February issue, along with the commitment to return to products of the Two-Cylinder Era as our primary focus. The two-cylinder LP-Gas tractor fea­ture of this issue will not be of interest to all readers, but we have tried to get the point across that these tractors are not a technical or mechanical mystery. Quite simply, they are disappearing from the landscape, and now it is estimat­ed that perhaps only one out of three or four John Deere collectors will be able to own one.

We appreciate input from readers, whether positive or negative, because it helps to guide us in our selection of magazine content. Obviously each member/subscriber will decide if our efforts are worth their attention. In any event, it is our commitment to work diligently to produce a quality publication worthy of presenting information on the products and history of John Deere.

I studied the remarks "Re-Engineering Two-Cylinder Magazine" in the November-December '07 issue (page 29), and the introduction on page 2 of the January-February '08 issue. It seems clear to me that subscribing members can make a big difference in the magazine. Don't you think it would be a good idea to bring this to the attention of subscribers in greater detail? As an example, would you have had to reduce the size of the magazine if subscribers had not dropped off about ten percent over the past couple of years? Just so you know, I would be more than willing to pay more for this magazine. I have not found any other source of information on John Deere products that is even worthy of consideration as a comparison. You are needed in this hobby. I think it would suffer greatly without Two-Cylinder magazine.

R.H., Illinois

Thanks for your supportive remarks. We discussed your proposal at length, and agree that there may be some value in demonstrating the approximate effect that membership at different levels would have on the magazine. Keep in mind, however, that the specific figures are a moving tar­get. The effects of inflation can be estimated, but not with absolute certainty.

We decided to provide three examples. Readers already can see what we are able to provide at a level of between 18- and 19-thousand members. So, let's move back to the 20- to 21-thousand range of two years ago. Yes, the mag­azine would still be at 112 pages, but we would have had to change the present 8-l/2"xl I" pages in any event, as the additional charge for nine-inch-wide pages has become prohibitive.

Now, let's take a look at where we'd be with a consistent publishing run of 24- to 25-thousand magazines. At the current membership rate, estimating inflation and counting on no further significant postal rate increases for awhile, the magazine would be increased to 120 pages.

Finally, at a consistent circulation level of 27,500 or more, page count would move to 128 pages per issue.

So, yes... It would make a big difference to all readers if we had more subscribers. We're giving you the straight talk on numbers. In no way would we fudge figures in an attempt to deceive anyone; or to attempt to attract more advertising which helps considerably insofar as offsetting magazine production costs. We have regular and continuing favorable comments from advertisers regarding the effectiveness of ads in Two-Cylinder, and are proud of that record.

We would very much like to increase the size of Two-Cylinder to 120 or 128 pages, but that's not possible without increasing incoming revenue. To add additional pages of pertinent information — intriguing items that most readers would likely not even imagine exist — simply requires that circulation increases to the levels described above. The question is; how do we do that? And the answer is; we can't, but you can. If each current sub­scriber/member added one new person to the circulation list, we'd be looking at a magazine of more than 128 pages. Clearly, we need the help of the current membership to spread the word and help the hobby to grow and stay vital for generations to come.

When I started to page through the "30" Series book, I just sat there stunned. I have enclosed a check for $105.00 for five more copies. I hope the $5.00 is the correct amount for shipping all five. If it is not, please let me know and I'll take care of it.

I'm going to keep my extra one in the shop, and the other four are going to be gifts for friends. I think this is the best information I've ever seen on these tractors.

J.V., Texas

As they say, the phone has been "ringing off the hook" around here. Plenty of people have now ordered additional copies. The $5.00 shipping to Continental U.S. locations is correct whether a person orders one book or a hundred.

We probably should have had more printed, but the decision was made and the printing plates are long gone. Oh well... That's hindsight. Sales may die down in the next month or two, and that ought to leave some books still available at the Expo in June. At least, that was the plan.

I recently purchased a 1944 John Deere Model "A" Tractor that is in excellent shape. The family that owned it said that it was only used in the field as the main tractor for three years, and then became their farmyard tractor when they bought a 1947 "A". They said it probably wasn't run a hundred hours a year, and was essentially retired in 1955 when they got a "70" Diesel.

I've been around antique tractors for 12 years, and this "A" looks like it's five-years old. My question is, should it be restored? It is an excellent example of a Wartime tractor, and would take very little to get it looking factory new. On the other hand, it hardly has its hair messed up now and could serve ay an authentic example just the way it is. Your turn.

S.A., New York

Leave it original! Your "A" may be among the top ten John Deere Wartime Tractors still in existence. If it was rough, that would be another matter, but having an exam­ple as you described is nothing less than extraordinary.

Five years ago I would have been disappointed in Two-Cylinder for having a feature article on New Generation Tractors. Not anymore! Thank you for laying down all of the available production informa­tion at one time. This issue (January-February 2008) will be a reference for the real John Deere collector for many years to come.

I'm wondering if you knew that the first 4030 (serial number 4030 001000R) sold last summer for over $52,000. It appears that some collectors are looking ahead and already including choice Genera­tion II Tractors in their plans. Be honest, did you expect this much enthusiasm for the later models?

F.M., Florida

To answer your last question first, we have to go into "harp" mode once again and remind everyone that New Generation Tractors were introduced 48 years ago. Even the Gen II 4030 that you mentioned is no youngster, dat­ing back to 1972. Last year, when it was sold, that tractor was right at 35-years old, five years beyond the 30-year mark that traditionally identifies a tractor as "vintage."

Expo attendees have the opportunity to observe trends in the vintage John Deere hobby, and there is absolutely no question that fewer tractors built before 1940 are showing up at these events. The "sweet zone" at this time is clearly the "20" and "30" Series Two-Cylinder Era, and we expect it to stay right there for many years to come. How­ever, the New Generation is attracting more than a modest amount of interest, which is expected to grow at a steady pace. The "Lettered" models will continue to be cherished by owners and the general public, and we are especially grateful that so many exhibitors bring these fine, older examples of John Deere ingenuity to the annual Worldwide Two-Cylinder Club Expos.

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